Letters to a Young Poet

[zalena]

I am in the rather frustrating position of being solicited for advice/criticism by a young poet. His poetry is incredibly bad and really more appropriate for someone 15 than it is 22. He is isolated from other artists and not particularly well read.

It is time for him to get past the 'yay! you can express yourself!' phrase and start getting involved in the critical cycle. He is not in school, though I plan to recommend some kind of Free University community group (though I'm not sure that will help, it will at least give him outlet and some kind of feedback that does not = me.)

However, what I think would help most (and what I often ask young writers, "What are you reading?") is engagement with other texts. Most of what he reads is smarmy metaphysical/business texts. And it really shows in his poetry. (Who knows, with that approach, we could have another best seller on our hands!)

So where do I recommend he start? Obviously this is not the time to break out the Baudelaire, though ultimately I believe that's the direction in which he's heading. He has a pretty heavy metaphysical load (also something he needs to lighten up) and too much abstract language. He really needs to work on imagery and (I believe) form, though he might not be open, or ready, for the later.

Imagine we are dealing with someone who can read, but who is functionally illiterate. He has no background or relationship to any kind of literature, (well, perhaps Dean R. Koontz) and yet, wants to be a writer.

Where do you tell someone like this to start? It would be one thing if I really was dealing with someone fourteen; but he's twenty-two and extremely sensitive to condescension. At this point I'm more interested in giving him something truly helpful than I am protecting his feelings.

Note: blessedly, this is not someone any of you have met

Comments

[averygoodun.livejournal.com]

Steinbeck. Especially appealing to males, I think.

He's also about the right age for Kerouac, I think. (haven't read OTR myself...)

L'Engle?
HH Munro?
Heinlein?

I want to say Dickens, but I know that he is NOT for the non-readers. "Wuthering Heights" might be up his alley though.

What has he read?

Re: What has he read?

[zalena.livejournal.com]

Q: What do you get when you cross an elephant with a rhino.

A: Elephino.

(Get it? Hell if I know... when we talk about books he mostly mentions smarmy business texts and Dean R. Koontz.)

[dr-tectonic.livejournal.com]

Maybe something like Turco's Book of Forms? I think the variety is sort of eye-opening, and all the examples he uses are good poems.

From what you describe, it sounds like what he needs to do is to look at a bunch of poems that are not the kind of thing he'd typically read but that someone with credibility has judged to be a good poem, and think about why that would be. What effect is each poet going for? What makes that poem tick?

I think that's what was the most valuable in the poetry workshop class I took as an undergraduate, was having to read poems that I didn't necessarily like, but try and give useful critique anyway. Because it forces you to step away from your own tastes and think about what works, and why.

And it also sounds like he just needs to read a lot of poetry. Maybe just give him a three-inch-thick anthology and tell him he needs to rate each poem in it on a scale of 1-5, with one sentence of explanation. Is that stupid, or would that actually work?

[orbitalmechanic.livejournal.com]

Yes, really, shouldn't he be reading poetry if he wants to write it? Louise Gluck is a current poet and fantastic at precision and imagery in the service of metaphysics. I bet he wants boys, though. Robert Frost? Maybe even Billy Collins? I heard Tony Hoagland do a wonderful reading once. Oh, how about the 180 project (http://www.loc.gov/poetry/180/p180-list.html)? Yes, here's Hoagland:

Maxine, back from a weekend with her boyfriend,
smiles like a big cat and says
that she's a conjugated verb.
She's been doing the direct object
with a second person pronoun named Phil,
and when she walks into the room,
everybody turns:

[etc]

[zalena.livejournal.com]

Great recommendations... I'VE been reading Louise Gluck, lately!

I'm guessing boys would be best. The real question is what is the thing that is going to trip his wire... his gateway book that leads to textual engagement.

[zalena.livejournal.com]

The anthology suggestion is interesting. There are two that were given to me that I found very helpful. One called Rattle Bag, the other is The Voice That is Great Within Us.

I have not heard of the Turco book. I will look it up.

Part of my pain in this situation is that I am the occasional scribbler of verse, but this is the area of the Word in which I am most private and least comfortable. I would love to improve my own, except that I generally HATE poetry classes.

an education

[boat-of-car.livejournal.com]

Hemingway
Fitzgerald
Gibson ( and/or Stephenson)
...just as a BEGINNING, these are great writers for a young man to be familiar with, and a broad range of stuff.

For poetry- Dylan Thomas, ee cummings, Keats/Byron, Pablo Neruda, maybe some Bukowski? also some Women, though there are many good ones that might be difficult for someone with his lack of education to get his head around.

And frankly- if you really want to write, noone can stop you, and it's the young writer's right to suck.

Re: an education

[zalena.livejournal.com]

if you really want to write, no one can stop you, and it's the young writer's right to suck.

I agree entirely, which is why I'm taking him seriously.

[arialas.livejournal.com]

I'd try to get him on a balanced diet of formal verse and contemporary free verse to understand and appreciate that free verse follows a form, usually one the poet has created - and it shouldn't be confused with lineated prose.

Contemporary poets: Mark Strand, Louise Gluck, Rosanna Warren, Frank Bidart, Robert Pinsky, John Ashbery, Adam Zagajewski

Others of interest: Keats, Hart Crane, Auden, Frost, Elizabeth Bishop, AE Housman, Edward Thomas.

[zalena.livejournal.com]

As usual, a wonderful list of recommendations. Thank you.

[borbor-chan.livejournal.com]

If attitude is part of his problem Kerouac, Bukowski et. al. will make it worse. They're terrific writers but give you such a bad personality you'd better have some talent (and friends) to burn when you start on them.

The bigass anthology idea is a good one, methinks. Having a spread you can browse and take-or-leave in sections is good when you're getting your feet wet.

[zalena.livejournal.com]

Friends to burn... lolz or whatever the kids are saying these days. I have to say that Kerouac lost me; I have been known to refer to the Beat poets as 'a veterans movement.' Bukowski overpublished. Which should be the FIFTEENTH deadly sin. But both tend to appeal to young men.

As far as I can tell talent and friends are both problems. He should be in college right now discussing this stuff with his peers and experimenting with mind-expanding experiences. Instead, he works like a dog. Which is part of what moves me about him. His desire is palpable. Who I am to refuse someone who so badly wants to serve the Word? A good reading list is the least I can offer.

[srotu27.livejournal.com]

FWIW, I think the best thing you can do is get him into a community of writers, where he'll see what they do, develop critical opinions, and get the same back. Even an online community would work, to start. My creative writing professor in college made us join listservs and it was a great place to bounce things off others. I was also part of an in-person writers' group, which worked well if you weren't clueless. Nobody would be outright nasty, but if you were clueless, you could take "what a powerful title!" for a compliment, when really, they were just trying to start off with something, anything, positive to say.

[ashfae.livejournal.com]

Elizabeth Bishop for definite.